We caught up with the brilliant and insightful Melina Palmer a few weeks ago and have shared our conversation below.

Hi Melina, thanks for joining us today. We’d love to have you retell us the story behind how you came up with the idea for your business, I think our audience would really enjoy hearing the backstory.

One paragraph changed my life. It was toward the end of my undergrad in Business Administration, Marketing and there was a tiny nod in one of my classes about the psychology of buying decisions. It was short, but it lit a spark in me. I had never really considered further education until that moment, but I declared to myself that I was going to get a master’s in this field someday. I spent the better part of ten years calling universities around the country, who all said this wasn’t a program — the field didn’t exist.

A bit discouraged, I put my dream on a shelf and focused on my marketing career.

Then, nearly a full decade later while in an innovation program, the organization brought in speakers from the Center for Advanced Hindsight at Duke University. Their work and research was exactly what I had been looking for! They told me the field was called “behavioral economics” and I found a master’s program and started immediately.

When I enrolled in the program, it was my intention to stay in industry (I was running a marketing department for a financial institution) but an unexpected move allowed me the opportunity to focus on my education. I had done freelance work for years and figured my education in behavioral economics would enhance my offerings, but that I would likely be a pretty standard marketing firm.

Even in the early days of my schooling, I realized that all the things that were so clear to me — about how behavioral economics could be applied to business communication, branding, strategy, goal achievement, and change management — was nowhere to be found. None of the readings or research was focused on this yet. But I knew it was critical for business and so I went all in.

Another serendipitous moment got me introduced to a business mentor with a very successful podcast who said to me, “I never tell anyone to start with a podcast, but you need to go do this immediately.” So, I did.

I spent the next six weeks rebranding my business, learning how to podcast, and launching it all before a big conference I was attending in the summer of 2018. I’ve come to learn that The Brainy Business podcast was the first of its kind in the world — a podcast in fun, relatable terms that helps people to understand and apply behavioral economics. It was always intended to be the top of my funnel, but I had no idea the doors it would open up for me: international consulting, keynote speaking, multiple books with a great publisher, a column with Inc, co-creating a certificate program in Applied Behavioral Economics and teaching for Texas A&M University.

Melina, before we move on to more of these sorts of questions, can you take some time to bring our readers up to speed on you and what you do?

Sure, I use the psychology of why people act, choose, change and buy to help great brands (and the people within them) to do greater things. As an applied behavioral economist, I specialize in understanding behavior — specifically customers and internal teams — to help businesses make better decisions and communicate more effectively.

My podcast, The Brainy Business, has downloads in over 170 countries and we kicked off 2023 with our 250th episode (which is a bit mind-boggling!). Over the years, I have learned that what sets me apart is my ability to take really complex, academic research and make it applicable (and fun) for everyone. Whoever said learning had to be boring? Not me!

Businesses choose to work with me when they care about the human side of business. I help them to understand how the brain really works (instead of how we think it should) and use that information to do more with less. I’ve written multiple books, including What Your Customer Wants and Can’t Tell You (which was a finalist in two categories of the International Book Awards) and What Your Employees Need and Can’t Tell You (which launched in October 2022).

The Brainy Business provides consulting and corporate training. I also do a lot of keynote speaking and teach applied behavioral economics through the Human Behavior Lab at Texas A&M University.

I would say I’m most proud of taking the leap to jump into the unknown and start a podcast and business that no one had really done in this industry yet. As a female small business owner, I know this isn’t always the norm, so that has also become a real focus for me — helping small businesses to learn and understand behavioral economics and apply it in their businesses — because all the big organizations are doing it. If small business doesn’t use behavioral science in their work, they will fail to compete, and that isn’t ok with me. So, in addition to the corporate work I do, I always keep time for the entrepreneurs as well as the intrapreneurs.

Any insights you can share with us about how you built up your social media presence?

The best way to build an audience on social media, is to focus on relationships. It is also important to share and comment and promote others more than you do yourself. Before I started my company, the company I worked for sponsored a local chapter of a female entrepreneurs’ group. I was able to attend the meetings nearly every month and saw the value of networking (and that business is a long game) first hand.

At one of those meetings, one of the speakers shared some numbers that have stuck with me for over 10 years now. She said that for every 100 people who see a post on social media, 10 will like it and only 1 will comment. I would be willing to bet that the numbers are even lower these days.

Social media has become more of “bullhorn media” — an opportunity for people to blast about themselves, but not really be social. However, everyone is always looking to see who has liked, commented on, or shared their posts. So, if you can be the person who proactively shares and leaves thoughtful comments on other peoples’ posts — they will notice!

Instead of spamming potential clients with information about you, read their posts. Comment on them. Share them with other people. Engage in conversation with them. This triggers reciprocity (a concept of behavioral economics) which makes it so people want to give back for gifts they have been given. So, when it is time to make your pitch, they are more likely to say yes because you gave first (and ideally multiple times).

Your time and thoughts are a free investment, and when you share other peoples’ stuff they will likely share about you as well, which can help to grow your network. Give first, post interesting content (that isn’t salesy) the majority of the time, and your network will grow.

Have you ever had to pivot?

I had been working for six years to be the Chief Marketing Officer at the financial institution I was at with a dream of being a financial institution CEO one day. It was my singular focus for a long time. Sure, I had a freelance “side hustle” ghostwriting blog posts for female entrepreneurs and editing books, but that was just a nice way to make a little extra money while doing something I enjoyed.

After years of work — and a promotion that was always six months away — some stars aligned that made it possible to dream a new dream. Leaving that role so close to the finish line was one of the hardest things I ever had to do.

It was scary to leave my corporate job and go all-in on my own business, but a fortuitous move made it so my (now) husband and I could move to a larger house closer to his work and I could focus full time on my school and building a business I loved (without pressure to take on clients or projects that I didn’t love).

One thing I have learned over the years is how small my dream was. I didn’t even imagine the possibilities of what my world is now — speaking at global conferences, working with Fortune 10 companies, helping entrepreneurs to achieve their dreams, teaching students around the globe, multiple books, a podcast…it is something I never would have come close to achieving if I hadn’t taken the leap and that hard pivot, but I’m so glad I did.

Contact Info:

• Website: www.thebrainybusiness.com
• Instagram: www.instagram.com/thebrainybiz
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thebrainybiz/
• Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/melina-palmer-36ab8712/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/thebrainybiz
• Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/c/thebrainybusiness