We recently connected with Jen Self and have shared our conversation below.

Jen, thanks for taking the time to share your stories with us today What’s the kindest thing anyone has ever done for you?

Kindness, not niceness, not politeness, but genuine kindness, where a person is making an offering of love and care, is an emotional connection that we all need and crave, and honestly, we receive far too infrequently.

Like so many of us, I developed ways of coping with stress, trauma, cultural negation, isolation, and all the things that many of us experience as queer, trans, nonbinary, and genderqueer folks. One of the ways I protected myself was through perfectionism, being hard on myself for mistakes before anyone else could take notice. I have been brutal to myself, mainly when I was younger. No room for mistakes for so much of my life, until I found a therapist, Anna Lyons Roost, LICSW.

She is a great therapist, incredibly skilled, and one of the most critical interventions she offered in these simple words, “and that is OK.” It reminded me of my brother saying those exact words to me when I called him in a panic from college at UC Berkeley and barely eeked out, “I’m gay.” He responded, “you know that’s ok, don’t you?”

Anna gave me this assurance repeatedly in our work. “Jen it is ok, it is ok to make mistakes. It is ok to be imperfect.” This may sound ridiculous, because so many of us got the message that it is ok to be human, to be flawed, to learn from mistakes. But for me, this act of kindness on repeat actually penetrated my defenses and I believed her and soon believed myself.,

Great, appreciate you sharing that with us. Before we ask you to share more of your insights, can you take a moment to introduce yourself and how you got to where you are today to our readers.

I am a Professional Troublemaker and an Emotional Teacher, I mean, I am a licensed clinical social worker, a power systems transformation strategist, a coach, an educator, and an abolitionist. I came to my empath and trouble-making ways through life experiences as a queer, genderqueer, neurodivergent, trauma-survivor who also was privileged by whiteness, education, and class. It was a mix of identities and experiences that positioned me as an outsider even as I was an insider. I lived in the cracks and edges of culture and searching for others who experienced the world as not made for them. I was always seeking equity and justice, by questioning the rules imposed by cultural systems that continue to hoard power. troubling norms that are taken for granted, that are built through systems of power that were meant to hoard power for some and undermine it for so many.

I am always balancing trouble-making and emotional teaching/learning, knowing that we are open to learning, let go of the notion that we should have already made it, we will be destabilized (productive zone of disequilibrium – Ronald Heifetz) and in that place of discomfort and destabilization, we can transform our thinking, being, and doing. We do not change without troubling and emotional intelligence.

How’d you build such a strong reputation within your market?

1) I always work in collaboration with people who have differing life experiences, cultural and racial identities, and any number of identities or experiences. Consequently, our clients are gaining the wisdom of multiple perspectives, modeling of cross-racial/gender relationships, and witnessing how we support and make space for one another.

2) I am exceptional at listening deeply to clients/organizations/leaders and honing in on the core of the difficulty or problem and then drawing connections up/over/across/and through so that they can see how the challenge is affecting their work as a system and as connected to their leadership.

3) I tell the truth, and I tell it clearly. If we are talking about. white supremacy, then that’s what we are speaking to, not around or under. I often say things that have gone unsaid, bring to light conditions or cultural norms that are not working for everyone, etc.

4) I see systems as connected to individuals and I see the systems inside of us as people and I help others make these connections. I am always helping leaders/clients make connections and insight as to how their micro leadership impacts the macro system.

5) I operate from a queered lens, meaning questioning the status quo – which includes white supremacy, cis/heteropatriarchy, ableism, nationalism, and so many interconnected systems of domination and power. I am always questioning norms, the status quo, and the way we are taught how things should be. I have lived in the grays of the world, living in the cracks of culture that so many of us don’t see. From these cracks and the unseen spaces where so many of us with marginalized and minoritized experiences reside – see bell hooks her writing about margins as places of power – from these spaces emerge vision, new ideas, belief in transformative processes, and slightly askew understanding of the world that helps others see and understand things differently.

Putting training and knowledge aside, what else do you think really matters in terms of succeeding in your field?

Troublemakers are visionaries. We are game changers. We are bringing us the vision of the future that we can build in our minds and bodies without ever having experienced it. And, that makes us dangerous to capitalism, so I am always wondering, how do we transform systems that were not meant for liberation, equity, and justice?

I do not have clear answers to that question. I believe futurists, artists, and all kinds of creators are critical to a movement to disengage from cultural norms of domination and inequity. Changemakers, are emergent leaders (thank you Adrienne Maree Brown) and we will continue to embrace that which emerges within connection, collaboration, being, embodiment, humility, curiosity, clarity, and purpose. Justice work is inherently throwing rocks in the machinery, so we will never be rewarded by power brokers. Centering the experiences, wisdom, leadership, and healing of those who have been furthest from justice in the way to transforming cultural systems. I am a blocker in this work. My job is to use my positionality to block and help create pathways for leadership that has always existed but heteropatriarchal white supremacy has worked to repress, suppress, and oppress. I am a trouble-maker, a blocker, an emotional teacher,

Humility is at the center of working with people and systems to transform and evolve. Humility and curiosity are so critical to wondering about a world or a system or a thought that we have yet to create. And, it is one of the building blocks of unlearning.

The amount of things I have needed to unlearn, well, it will take me a lifetime.

Contact Info:

• Website: https://www.brick13.com
• Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drjenself13

Image Credits

Liz Cruz photography