We were lucky to catch up with Hayley MacLeod recently and have shared our conversation below.

Hayley, appreciate you joining us today. Some of the most interesting parts of our journey emerge from areas where we believe something that most people in our industry do not – do you have something like that?

I think a lot of people in the industry, and in general, believe that good design is luxury service that only people with wealth can enjoy. While I do agree that there is an element of luxury to design, ANYONE can make good design decisions regardless of budget if they are given the right information. This plays a lot into how interior design is valued in general. A lot of folks think we just “pick out pretty things” and therefore they can do what we do all by themselves without an education or experience. What people fail to realize is that our job is so much more than just picking stuff out. My value comes from my experience and all the tiny details that I focus on that the average non-designer doesn’t even know to look for. All that to say, one of the things I strive to do with every one of my clients, regardless of budget, is to educate. If I can teach them why and how I’m making the decisions that I do for their project, then they can learn from that and apply it no matter how expensive their project is. While I believe all designers know that we have value, I think a lot of them don’t necessarily feel like education is part of their job and don’t want to freely give it away. Which is totally fair, but I really think that good, informed design decisions can be made by everyone at all budget levels.

Awesome – so before we get into the rest of our questions, can you briefly introduce yourself to our readers.

I’ve known I wanted to be an interior designer since I was 9 years old. Watching Candice Olson on HGTV inspired me to want to create beautiful spaces for other people. Every decision I made from the time I was 9 until I was 18 going to college was made towards the ultimate goal of becoming an interior designer. By the time I got to college and was immersed in the design program at San Francisco State, I knew I was meant to do this. However, I never thought I wanted to be a business owner. I just wanted to work my way up to a senior designer so that I could continue to do what I love without all the back end tasks. Fast forward to 2025, I’ve been a designer for over a decade and am working on building my own business. Over the years I’ve grown a deep love for more of the building and hard surface side of design. I specialize in residential new constructions and remodels and aim to make not only my clients’ lives easier, but also help the build team ensure everything goes smoothly. I love being the interface between everyone. I treat every project like a puzzle and love the challenge of making all the pieces fit together to create something not only beautiful, but also functional. The goal is always to improve the day to day lives of my clients by really listening to their needs and using my expertise to provide them with a usable and visual appealing space that is unique to them.

How about pivoting – can you share the story of a time you’ve had to pivot?

Actually, the whole reason I started this business was based on a need to pivot. As mentioned before, I never wanted to be a business owner. All throughout college we had to take “Business of Interior Design” classes to learn about how to run and manage an interior design business. Every class to me sounded like “how not to get sued” and I very quickly came to the conclusion that that was not for me. Moving along in my career I was feeling great about being employed. I had worked for my previous firm for 7 years and made my wall all the way to Senior Designer. I was my boss’ right hand and was essentially managing all the bigger projects we were working on. Not only that, but I had crafted many of the processes and set most of the standards we were using. After the pandemic, the business changed and slowed and I was informed that I was no longer going to be an employee. It was in that moment I realized I had essentially already built one business for someone else, why couldn’t I do it for myself? So I did! There’s a lot that’s still a work in progress but ultimately it feels like the right time and logical next career move.

What’s a lesson you had to unlearn and what’s the backstory?

The lesson I had to unlearn is that there’s a “right way” to do things; especially in this business. I think each person’s right way to the same result will be vastly different based on their personality, experiences, and skills and that’s ok! Growing up and even into my adulthood and career, I’ve had to do a lot of therapy and inner work to recognize that my way does not equal the best way. Seeing something from someone else’s perspective can really help to solidify that and can also open up your mind to new possibilities of how to do things. We love to keep learning!

Contact Info:

• Website: https://www.shadowandfern.com
• Instagram: @shadowandfern.studio
• Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hayley-macleod-29648095
• Other: Google: https://g.co/kgs/gHME5tG