We recently connected with Charlie Mato-Toyela and have shared our conversation below.

Charlie, thanks for taking the time to share your stories with us today Can you tell us about a time that your work has been misunderstood? Why do you think it happened and did any interesting insights emerge from the experience?

As a young person, I grew up with a very diverse array of Native American friends and family. My home, for the bulk of my childhood, was also in the middle of a dominantly Black/African-American community. For this reason, my closest friends while growing up were primarily one of these two groups of people. When you grow up as a Native American but living outside of your specific Native American community, oftentimes you become an icon or pillar of another community. This is simple math. In my youth, I spent a great deal of time with a few various tribes that I helped out with multiple programs and events and even spoke on their behalf upon request to newspaper and other media. At the same time, hanging out with various traditionalists, I learned that there is a separation between Native Americans’ feelings about groups or tribes that are not their own. At times I would find myself using derogatory terminology to depict various groups who knew less about their culture than others simply because some of the people I hung out with did the same. It is unfortunate that it took a lifetime for me to understand the significance of all Native peoples. Now I realize the truth of the old adage “you never know a person until you’ve walked a thousand miles in their moccasins.” After some serious growing up and even living around “proclaimed traditionalists” who the world recognizes as such today but oftentimes those of us who know better do not, I have learned a philosophy of Live and Let live. There is something we each can learn from one another. And most importantly, just because someone or even a group of people are “loud”, it doesn’t mean they are right!
Within the last year, I have attended meetings with the US government on behalf of many Native Americans, that I or my friends would have called fakes in my youth, and in doing so, I have found myself on the other side of the fence. Young groups of angry Natives as well as non-natives have since attacked me. Ironically accusing me of not being Native myself. As a child, I did not want to be a card carrying Indian. I didn’t believe in it because it was submission to a government to give me the right to be who I was. I knew at that time no one could do that. A lifetime later I have learned that that is not only the truth for me but for all those who are part of an “official” Native American tribe as I am regardless of what level it has attained with the US government or even the many who are not part of a tribe. Unfortunately certain organizations/tribes did not grow up as I did and learn to respect and understand all other people. At this point in my life, I have found myself fighting for those who I was taught to dislike in my youth. I have learned from them, I’ve had ceremonies with them and have grown through them. I have realized that not everything is so simple as black and white. I have found myself on the side of the fence that has demanded that I prove who I am. In doing so, I have found nothing but more Native Ancestors as well as friends/family in the process. I am proud to have family who were Cherokee, Choctaw, Lumbee, Creek, Tuscarora, Peedee, Dakota/Ojibwe and Kuna. When I think about the family members who were of these various tribes, it reminds me that at some point or another down the road they have all turned into the ‘one and only me’. Likewise, the people of these tribes came from tribes that we don’t remember the names for anymore. Some of them the same and some of them enemies. In some cases even the same tribes were fighting against one another (just as they do today). However, all of these people helped me to come this far! Today when I make “Native American Flutes” for a living, as it has been my business to do so now for 38 years, and someone asks me to make them an “XYZ-Tribe’s flute” in a specific key, I take it as an opportunity to educate the public about the flute’s origins and how these things were so well shared through various tribes that it is nearly impossible to tell if a specific flute is a type made by a specific people and of course we never historically tuned flutes to scales or frequencies until after colonization.

Great, appreciate you sharing that with us. Before we ask you to share more of your insights, can you take a moment to introduce yourself and how you got to where you are today to our readers.

My name is Charlie Mato-Toyela. I’m a member of the United Cherokee AniYunWiYa Nation, an official state recognized tribe in my ancestors’ home of beautiful Alabama. I’ve been making Native American flutes since my grandfather showed me how to make a small Cherokee whistle when I was a child. After he showed me this very special instrument, I learned more from a distant cousin who had already created 10 or 20 flutes. At this point in my life, I have made thousands more Native American flutes than anyone I’ve ever even heard of with the help of my oldest son River and my wife Jessie (and at times, my other two children help as well) in our workshop sometimes 7 days a week! As my wife says – even when we’re not in the shop, we’re answering customer’s emails, phone calls, setting up new how-to videos or planning for whatever the next big thing that happens with our business! Our countless YouTube videos accompanied by our Instagram and Tick Tock videos have offered the public everything from relaxing flute music and examples of varying instruments to how-to tutorials on making or playing their own Native American flutes. In this particular fashion not only do I give the people of the world and opportunity to learn to make and play their own flute, I have also proudly created many of what would seem to be my own competition!

Do you think there is something that non-creatives might struggle to understand about your journey as a creative? Maybe you can shed some light?

I personally believe everyone has creativity in them. I know this firsthand because I have taught so many. Oftentimes people will start the conversation with “I’m not a skilled musician” and I have to stop and tell them don’t worry, most other people who play this instrument aren’t a skilled musician either! There is insight other than that I would like to offer. One of the biggest difficulties for artists today is selling their art. I can tell you from my own experience that whatever you sell your art for is always a compromise. The public could never understand its value to you. Even if you’re some wealthy philanthropist selling popsicle-stick creations that you make (and have the backing of countless wealthy associates), what you make is still, even if only in a small way, a piece of history. There’s no price you can put on any of that!

We’d love to hear the story of how you built up your social media audience?

The best advice I could offer anyone in building their social media audience, or even their real life audience, is to be honest. Not only can some people tell when you’re lying, but in order to better mankind, you really shouldn’t lie. If you offer the world the honest beautiful truth, even if some people don’t see it that way, the world is better for it! As much as the general public has been taught to love negative things, something deep inside of them still appreciates the positive more!

Contact Info:

• Website: bluebearflutes.com
• Instagram: instagram.com/bluebearflutes
• Facebook: facebook.com/bluebearflutes
• Youtube: youtube.com/bluebearflutes
• Other: tiktok.com/@bluebearflutes

Image Credits
The cat in one image was “Renault-the Snake Killer”. The young lady is my daughter Makasha Mato-Toyela who sometimes helps in the shop; in the image with her, she was completing an apprenticeship program that I was doing with her. The older gentleman in the one image was my dear friend Canela Cervantes. He was a mentor, a brother, an artist and a gifted individual. He passed away a few years ago, however he helped me to understand the similarities of many Native American Cultures, even if separated by vast distance!